Episode 71 – After the Silence (Wayqeycuna)

Gabrielle Martin: Hello and welcome to Push Play, a Push Festival podcast featuring conversations with artists who are pushing boundaries and playing with form. I’m Gabrielle Martin, Push’s artistic director, and today’s episode highlights artivism, holding space, and art as the place we will be able to meet after the silence.

I’m speaking with Cecilia Kuska, executive producer of Wayqekuna by Tiziano Cruz, which is being presented at the Push Festival February sixth to seventh, 2026. Like a quipu, the intricate system of knotted cords used by Andean peoples to record memory and knowledge, Wayqekuna traces Argentinian artist Tiziano Cruz’s path back to his childhood in the Andean North.

Through a poetic layering of testimony, ritual, and performance, this final work in his trilogy unfolds as an act of return and repair, a lament for what has been taken and a celebration of what persists. But in this episode, we will step slightly outside of our usual format to speak with Cecilia not only about Wayqekuna, but about her long collaboration with Tiziano Cruz, her cross-continental curatorial work through Rosa Studio and Próximamente, and her wider insights into the geopolitical and artistic conditions shaping contemporary Latin American performance today.

Cecilia is an Argentinian-born, globally active producer, curator, and cultural strategist whose work spans contemporary performance, cross-border collaboration, and institutional transformation. As founder of Rosa Studio and artistic coordinator and co-curator of Próximamente at KVS in Brussels, she supports Latin American artists within complex geopolitical landscapes, building platforms grounded in horizontal curatorial models and transnational exchange.

Her career includes key roles across Europe and South America, curating, producing, and advising for major festivals, networks, and cultural institutions committed to new dramaturgies and post-colonial artistic practices. Here is my conversation with Cecilia.

So just before we get started, I want to begin, I wanna acknowledge this conversation, um, is happening for me, I’m joining on the unceded traditional and ancestral territories of the Musqueam, Squamish, and Tsleil-Waututh Nations. And as I’m speaking with you, Cecilia, about the work, your work and the works of artists like Tiziano Cruz and Lucas Avendano, um, artists who confront erasure, reclaim ancestral memory, and challenge colonial frameworks to their own embodied histories.

I want to honor the indigenous nations whose sovereignties, cosmologies, and cultural practices endure here despite ongoing, uh, colonial systems. So their presence reminds me that the struggles, um, these works engage with, land lineage, disappearance, and survival, are also very much lived realities on this territory.

And Cecilia, where are you joining the conversation from today? 

Cecilia Kuska: Hello, Gabrielle and everyone. Well, right now I’m in the cold night of Brussels, so I’m joining from here. Uh, this is a land that’s shaped by centuries of migration and communities for many parts of the world who have made this city what it is today, and my work is also, uh, centered about that, on that.

And as a South American born, living now in what we call Europe, I’m always aware, aware of like histories and dis- o- about displacement, colonialism, movement that shape our presence on any territory, which is also part of my, my lineage, of my ancestors, of my family history. I’m second generation of people who had to migrate, who had to flee, uh, because of war.

There were all my grandparents, uh, refugees that end up in what is now South America. So I try to approach each place where I live or where I go transit work, uh, or connect with a lot of respect about its past, and also about the communities that holds the story of that territory. 

Gabrielle Martin: I, I wanna first start by talking about, a little bit about Tiziano Cruz’s work because that’s, um, really- Well, I guess I met you…

I was gonna say I met you through his work, but that’s not true. I met you at FIBA 2022, and we had great conversations, but you introduced me to Tiziano’s work, and then I got to know you through having you here with Tiziano at the festival. So you’ve accompanied Tiziano’s work across multiple contexts from Soliloquio, which was so incredible to have here, really impacted our audiences in 2023, to WakheCuna, which will be at the festival in ’26.

So you’ve accompanied, uh, these works as executive producer, tour manager, and close artistic interlocutor. And how has witnessing his process or his processes shaped your understanding of what his work is doing politically, spiritually, and dramaturgically? 

Cecilia Kuska: Well, first, I, I wanted to share that, uh, I joined, uh, Tiziano when he just finished Soliloquy creation with a great group of other creators like UN Company working also with him, and, and it was a, a, a big, like- Uh, surprised to find an artist like him performing on, on a stage in all this speech in, uh, in Buenos Aires.

For me, it was very strong and very pregnant and, and it was like a, uh, like a change moment for me to, to meet this artist and meet this work. So, and so we have been collaborating for already three years. And, um, and, and also we have toured the world with these, uh, works with also with Soliloquy and Waikekuna.

And so witnessing this, this evolution of the career and o- of how to take, how to arrive to other lands with the, with the work of Tiziano has been very, very deep for me in many levels. And also because I feel one of the most interesting things about Tiziano’s creations are this connection about community through a very contemporary language.

So because he managed to rexi- like, make another sense, another meaning o- on, on, on what it means to work through communal rituals, through a practice on, on, in a very dramaturgical contemporary way, and revealing how performance can be political, spiritually, and also with a, a religion with the context in where we go, and without losing the complexity of an artistic creation, of cr- of creativity.

So I feel his processes are constantly reminding us that how can contemporary art can be also a space of caring, of listening, and of encounter with others, with, with, as I just said, also with the local realities. And it has been very, very important to see how we started, how he started his first, first, like, for example, edition, let’s say it, of Soliloquy.

That means working with local communities. So the first time he did it was in Buenos Aires, working with a large community of people living more in the margins of the city. And it was a big demonstration on the, on the biggest, like, avenue of the theaters of Buenos Aires, our kind of Broadway, and how that could be translated to other lands in dialogue with what is happening in those lands.

And actually in Push, we replaced that part with videos explaining how that happened in different places of the world. That was also very interesting and very, very important for, for this kind of creation. And now in Waikekuna, the first part of the show is, uh, a workshop that we do involving like the audiences that can come to see the work or other audiences that we like onl- only to come to the workshop and we prepare bread together.

And it’s, it’s coming back to our bodies, it’s coming back to our hands to connect between us, not through a computer, just there, just holding a space there. And I think this concept of holding the space is something that is always entering in my practice, and this is why I feel very inspired of what happened or what has been happening with the work of Tiziano along these years arriving to different places in the world.

And, and I think it’s, it’s very important how, how is this, uh, understanding of how dramaturgy and community waving to coexist in very powerful ways. 

Gabrielle Martin: I’m brought back to, uh, Buenos Aires, and I should say, I said, mentioned FIVA, but I didn’t explain that that’s the Festival Internacional. I say it with a French accent, Internacional de Buenos Aires.

Um, and, and I was there in the streets, like experiencing that part of Suliloquy, and then, and then also the theat- the, the part that takes place in the theater. But it’s so incredible the, um, because each piece has such a community engagement, um, aspect to it, it’s a real, um, a feat to realize that with care in each different location and to realize it in a way that makes sense for that locality.

And, and I think that’s something that’s so, um Incredible about, like, the commitment of this work. It, it’s what makes the work that much more, like, impactful for the community. So clearly there’s so much value in that, and it’s also so much more, um, work on your part, on Tiziano’s part, um, to really make sure…

And, and of course the, the communities that are, uh, engaging and collaborating, um, to really make sure that that lands in a meaningful way. But it seems to me like you have such, um, experience, both that you bring from your other projects, that Tiziano’s team has, that it just- when I’ve encountered it, for example, at Festival TransAmériques, at the Waykaycuna Bread for the World workshop, it’s just like, it just, it just feels effortless when you’re in the room with it.

Cecilia Kuska: Yeah. And I feel something that happened also in PUSH when we were, we were there the first time, it was a very deep and, um, profound encounter with the audience. It was a very interesting engagement with the local audience, with the audiences that were there in the, in the room. Like, we felt that was one of the times that was very, very important to be there doing the work.

So we are really looking forward to see what happens with this new show, uh, because the first time was really very special for all of us. 

Gabrielle Martin: Yeah. I, I wanna talk a little bit more about your, your practice, like, uh, um, beyond working with Tiziano. So as an Argentinian producing and curating work across Latin America and Europe, how do you navigate the geopolitical realities that shape which Latin American artists are visible internationally, which stories circulate, and which remain at the margins?

Um, because, you know, I’ve seen you really speaking about these things, for example, at the Office National de Diffusion Artistique and, and the conference and, of, of French, uh, presenters in France, really kind of, um, holding space for these conversations internationally. Um, yeah, and also, like, what patterns or structural conditions do you feel are most shaping Latin American performance today?

Cecilia Kuska: So first, uh, I want to share that my career actually started from Argentina, working in the Buenos Aires International Festival, hosting international companies. And then when we, when I moved to Europe, that I first live in the UK and now in Belgium, it was to change also that lo- logic of welcoming to, to offering in some way, let’s say it.

Um, so for me it’s very important, like, how I could, uh, build, like, a knowledge in, in both regions, like how to, you know, understand the different context. And, and I feel that’s very important to understand when we work with a region or with different regions or connecting regions. So, so specifically about Latin America, I feel it’s always very complex because it’s, it’s a region that is too vast, too div- diverse, that is impossible to understand it fully unless you study history, sociology, like many subjects to…

I study history of art, so I have, I feel like, a nice background to, to make the work I do. But, but there are s- also so d- different and, and not so different, like, narratives as political conditions in the region. So there are some countries that they maintain more public or private cultural policies that, that facilitates a lot the internationalization and visibility of the artists that live in those countries.

Others face more, like, structural barriers, historical structural barriers, I would say. Like, political instability, that is something that in most of the countries happens, but in certain places more than in others. And, and cultural policies is something that is very, like, linked to that. And so the absence of international platforms where programmers can come to those countries and see the work or understand the context are very crucial.

And for example, this year you just mentioned that I work with the Onda, uh, in France for, in different situations. One was in France to, to create a workshop to think how we can be more aware of the logics of how we work in international cooperation, h- all the imbalances that we have when we are approaching an, an international cooperation project.

And then this year I collaborated with Onda again to curate a program in Buenos Aires in ar- inviting artists from different parts of Argentina to understand the local scene. And to understand the local scene, I focus a lot on how, who is, is sustaining the scene, all the people who is behind. 

Gabrielle Martin: And this, this was, there were a number of French presenters who came.

Cecilia Kuska: Yeah. Yeah. French and also some Canadian presenters. Like, it, it was mostly French presenters- Mm-hmm … but, uh, yeah, so- Yeah, and some Latin American presenters as well. So this is something, there is something that is important to understand that historically artists from countries like Argentina, Chile, Uruguay, Mexico, Brazil, also Colombia have circulated more, uh, worldwide Because in these countries, they had or have depending on each, uh, place, very strong like international festivals or networks that, that can face the, the, the challenges of the, the countries and that also facilitate a lot these international connections.

So, so and then there are other places where independent cultural workers or in, uh, private, uh, foundations or associations or theaters, they make a big effort for connecting the local artists worldwide. The ca- the case, for example, in Peru right now that they have two major festivals are Sala Apart and FIA Lima, where many different organizations, like in FIA Lima, they collaborate.

Actually, Sala Aparto, that is one program, is part of the other festival, and they make a lot of efforts between local colleagues to just visibilize the, what is happening with the artists in Peru, uh, with, for example, lack of public fundings in many cases. And it’s very interesting how they, from what they have, they do a lot for the visibility of their own local scene.

So, so I feel, uh, coming back to this, that certain country had m- more longer time, uh, you know, pos- uh, like, uh, cultural policies or, uh, international events for connecting globally. That’s also something that is very deep in who is arriving where or which kind of artists are usually in international programs, what circulates more internationally.

So and also then you have what the markets decide, what the art market decide, and that is usually more from the north to the south, where is more money to where is less money, and where sometimes there is a strong interest in, in works dealing with economic, racial, historical, or social crisis. Uh, crisis that, of course, affect humanity worldwide, but it’s a good way to reflect from what is happening there to what is happening in the context where we take those projects.

But I feel there is a pro- a problem that we discuss a lot in different kind of laboratories or encounters about exchanges between Latin America and Europe. That’s, uh, is when the, the Latin American crisis starts to be romanticized aesthetically in programs where there is no, uh, strong knowledge of how to present those projects.

So without really understanding deeper the context of what we call Latin America, because it’s, it’s a creation, the meaning of Latin America that was created from France to what we now, how we now name this region. So, so I feel that it, it’s very important to also have a knowledge of of, of what kind of extractivism a- are happening from the beginning to nowadays, um, that are beyond the specific colonial period or if c- or if, uh, sorry, or if each country.

Uh, there are o- logics that are post-colonial logics, that are contemporary, that are neoliberalist ways, that is a result of what has been the colony in many countries of the world. So So I feel like it’s important how this dynamic shift with each global crisis. And, and my hope is that we can strengthen the circulation models that are less dependent on Eurocentric validation of the works and can be more attentive to regional diversity, equity, and plurality.

So I feel also a way of doing that is be in dialogue with, uh, with colleagues that are there, with artists, with producers, with programmers that are in each region, and how we talk also with them and not only just go and see work and then go back home and decide what will be invited to our festivals wherever we are.

Gabrielle Martin: Um, so as someone shaping platforms like Próximamente and building cross-border structures of support, how do you understand the curatorial responsibilities and possibilities of presenting Latin American work in the European context today? So I would love to hear you speak a bit more about that and, and also what approaches guide Próximamente’s model and your own curatorial thinking as you navigate questions of representation, post-colonial framing, and the material realities artists are facing.

Cecilia Kuska: So Próximamente is a, like, festival platform that we do at the KVS, which is the Flemish city theater of Brussels. Uh, it’s not only me. We are also a group of people doing it. And it’s important because those are the, the basis of what we do and how we do and why we do. And, and in a city like Brussels where 60% of the population approximately is migrant, we question a lot from this theater and from the Próximamente platform, where is Europe?

Uh, where is Europe? Where is the European audience also, no? Um, so we can’t ignore the people who actually build and, and, and, and, and give life to the f- to the cultural fabric of, of the city where we are doing the festival and, and the platform. So the curatorial model that we approach is, uh, is based on horizontal dialogues between, was, as what I was saying, between colleagues that are across both regions.

So colleagues that are based in Latin- in what we call Latin America and us, like, we are two in the team of Próximamente that we belong to the Latin American diaspora. So we have also this experience of being Latin Americans living in Europe and the program involves also artists that are living in what is Europe now and artists still living in, in, in Latin America or Caribe.

And we aim to, to challenge a lot this idea of who can speak, from where you speak, what is an institution, what is established by an institution, and, and how we can also approach, like, a very diverse multilingual and shape Uh, uh, when shaping audience, audience involving the diasporas that are on those audiences and how we are always without sometimes, um, like being aware of that, how easy is to ignore or exclude certain communities that we have in the places where we are producing or presenting.

So, so the curatorial, the, the, the, the idea of how, how to curate for me is a huge responsibility as a person and also as how I see it with, with other colleagues. And so for me, it’s more curate, like, like it’s more about asking. And asking, I mean, like are we imposing or are we listening? Are we protecting the artists that we are approaching to collaborate?

Are we creating, creating conditions of care for them or we are just presenting? And so for example, in the case of Lucas Abandano, that is an artist that was in our program and will go now to Push. Uh, w- in one of the long conversations I had with Lucas when we were preparing the last edition of our program was, like, I asked them, uh, him, um, like, “What do you want to do with us?”

And Lucas was surprised and told me like, “Wow, usually, like, uh, festivals or, or major, like, cultural institutions tell me what they want from me, but it’s not so common that they listen what I would like to do.” And so for us, like, the difference is what it matters, you know? The difference of how we work with others, and it’s between us as a team, between the colleagues that we are in dialogue for creating programs.

Uh, and also, uh, yeah, how, how it is the relation that we establish with each artist. So what we try is to have only a few, like, finished works and then to support creative process of, uh, of works that are not fully finished, and connect all these processes with different organizations in Europe, with different kind of, uh, uh, residency spaces.

So, uh, so it’s a way of, of making visi- like, or make visibility for a whole team. Sometimes, like, can be one artist that comes, sometimes can be the artist with its producer that is based, for example, in a small town in Brazil, and we try to find also visibility and opportunities for that producer. So it’s really how we visibilize everyone.

Like, let’s open the space for everyone and let’s hold the space together. So I feel Próximamente is about that, and it’s also how I like to work. Uh, how to, yeah, to, to open the space. 

Gabrielle Martin: So you’re, um, you’re curating, you’re also producing. You’re producing festivals, you’re producing, uh, performances through the artists you’re, you’re working with.

Um, so through Rosa Studio, you … A lot of it’s under Rosa Studio is my understanding, and you’re supporting cross-border projects, contemporary creation. And we’ve spoken about Próximamente, where you’re co-creating one of the most vital platforms for Latin American work in Europe. And how do these two roles speak to each other?

What distinct curatorial or ethical principles guide you when you’re producing a program versus a performance? I hear that you’ve spoken about that in terms of holding space and, like, y- you’ve just kind of been speaking about that. But if you can elaborate on that, that would be great. 

Cecilia Kuska: Yeah. I feel like it’s a, quite a gift to work from producing to programming.

Uh, and all my career has been, like- Going from one role to the other role. And I feel like as, as a producer of, of, of new works or, or producer on tour, I can be very close to the realities of the, that the artists have to face to get where they are or to arrive where they would like to arrive. And like, so from visa issues to fees to access to funding to gas, you know, rejecting from residencies that usually are very concentrate on the same kind of artists or working on the same kind of topic.

So I feel this experience is deeply like informs my, my curatorial work. So I believe like curators or programmers, uh, facilitators, let’s, let’s call it in different ways, uh, who have never produced independently or, or suffer, suffer like what the challenges of being an independent artist often miss something that for me is very crucial on the layer of understanding the logistical, emotional, and political challenges be- behind like each work.

And so I feel like blessed that I could have these both experiences to improve in one and the other. So what I, what I, what I, what I feel is in both is, is, is my, my way of trying to do it in a respectful way Uh, accepting that I make mistakes like everyone, and always prioritizing what I said before also, the concept of care over of trends.

Because there is a lot in our scene that is moved by what is the trending thing now, and craving a space for artists who need more visibility or support or that they never had the possibility of having the support like other artists from certain social classes or for central, central, like, for certain, like, more center cities.

So I try to balance a lot the listening with theory. So I feel like we can’t build curatorial practice only from academic frameworks. It’s very interesting, but we can also not exclude all the autodidact artists or curators whose perspectives are very vital, vital, sorry. And, and working across Rosa Studio, that is the studio that I founded in pandemic times and proximamente, yes, it’s, it’s, it’s very, it’s very like a, as I said, like a gift.

Producing, like, keeps me grounded and curating, programming, or coordinating artistically, that is what I do in the festival, allows me to open doors, to open more doors than, than the ones that I can do producing because producing takes a lot of time of yourself, and sometimes you can’t produce all the artists you would like.

So it’s a good balance to, okay, I can’t produce this artist, but then I can, you know, mediate or open a space or open a residency or something for this other artist. Uh, so I never, I always try to no place myself above the artist or pr- or, or as a programmer, as a producer. And, and also I try to convince the artist that they never have to feel that they are above others.

‘Cause also I feel it’s something that the market tries to put, you know, this idea of the artist as a genius. And, and that we are all part of a collective effort. That is how we can represent and be present together. So I believe it’s everything at the end is about how to come together, as I said before.

Uh, how representation can be, can happen in different ways. And, and so I believe also in the, in the importance, that is something that the practice gave me, on, on supporting colleagues. Like, colleagues are also programming, producing. How we can, you know, exchange more and not be in competition of, ah, you have the artist I would like, or…

No, it’s like, “Hey, how was your experience about this?” Sharing the knowledge, sharing the knowledge with new generations. Like, how can we support new producers or new artists to enter, you know? And I feel that’s something that is really, it’s really about this practice of being in one role and the other role at the same time.

Gabrielle Martin: Mm-hmm. And that generosity in your approach is so clear. I think it’s tied into your success ’cause you’re- … doing very important things and, uh, having a big impact on the sector. Um, and you’re also everywhere and, like, and, and beloved by so many. And, uh, yeah, from the first moment we met, there was just such a generosity.

Um, first of all, you know, it’s, it’s always so inspiring to speak to you. Um, everything you’ve been sharing, your philosophy that is very much lived, uh, in your practice, um, translated into, yeah, into really how you’re working. Um, but yeah, your generosity. And so, um, part of that generosity is, is you’re connecting me with Tiziano and introducing me to the work of Lucas Abin Daniel.

Um, and so yeah, we’re so thrilled that Bardá will be presented here now at Push, and, and as you mentioned, it was presented at Próximamente in 2024. I’m curious to know a bit more about your relationship with Lucas’s work. Um, so what first drew you to, uh, his practice? I know that, um, he goes by he and they.

Um, and how do you understand the particular force of their work, its cosmology, its ritual poetics, its challenges to state violence and colonial gender framework? So yeah, that, you know, within the wider landscape of Latin American contemporary performance 

Cecilia Kuska: So I first encountered Lucas through a colleague.

Like, this is a recommendation of colleague from colleagues, or female colleagues. So it was Martin Capieda is also an artist from Colombia and curator. Then, uh, it was, uh, we have a partner for Próximamente in Mexico that is the University Festival of UNAM. So the programmer of the festival, Jacqueline, also talk about Lucas, and then the Mexican Embassy in Belgium also talk about Lucas.

So it was really… And, and now I pass Lucas to you. So, uh, I mean, his, his and their name appear, like, a lot through people and I, I th- I … Before, uh, like, uh, seeing the work, I was like, “Okay, I trust that if we are all talking well about someone, it, it’s meant to be in some way.” So I feel like it’s not only about the quality of the work when we approach an artist, it’s also the person, and I feel Lucas is the sum of both.

He’s a very kind person to work with and very inspiring artist, and as you said, it’s very important, their voice for the Latin American las- landscape of the past and nowadays. So … And I feel there is something very authentic of how the creation that Lucas, like, uh, uh, carry on is very root in, in its territory.

In the sounds, in the colors, in the, in their family history, and in, and all the things they had to suffer and live. And how Lucas also is someone that I feel like gives a voice to other voices that not always has the chance to, uh, to have a stage or to have a place or to have a mic or to have a online visibility as Lucas.

And it’s actually something that I once discussed with Lucas. And, and, and because, uh, when we were preparing, like, their presentation for the last edition of our festival, uh, he was suffering a very, uh, like a tough situation, like, that he’s was threatening and also his family. And, and I asked, like, Lucas, why you are still, like, would you like to stay in Mexico?

And Lucas was like, “Yeah, of course. I, I … Like, a lot of people is offering me, like, a refugee shelter or something, but my work and my life is dedicated to my people. If I leave, I’m leaving an empty space for all the people that can have access to have a voice or to make a big demonstration performance on the streets of this country or to be in international platforms to talk about these struggles.”

So I feel this is something very, very, very pregnant about the, the work and how Lucas, like, uh, makes- collaborations because some of the works are like solos, and then there are others where Lucas collaborates with a lot of people, like in public space, on stage. Like, it’s a very vast and, and, and, and diverse, like, uh, uh, creative landscape what Lucas has been developing.

And I think in Latin America itself as, as, as post-colonial, as a post-colonial construction, uh, our societies continue excluding a lot indigenous cultures or include them only in a very hierarchical place like in symbolic ways. So, so I feel like Lucas exposes this, and his work can be also experienced in, in very aes- in different aesthetics, in different ways.

Like, it’s, it’s … I feel it’s an invitation of how to be present in a cosmology that transcends the borders. So sometimes maybe you don’t understand fully the background of what is, uh, uh, what is base the performance, but you can feel a lot. And you can feel also this multiplicity of languages and aesthetics and visuals that, that, that the territory of Latin America can happen, can, can happen and, and the urgency and the struggles of this territory.

So yeah, I, I feel it’s a, it’s a very, very important artist, uh, because it’s It’s, it’s always taking the I to we. 

Gabrielle Martin: Mm. 

Cecilia Kuska: And so when, when, when Lucas was in, in, in, in Proxente last year, uh, we did, we present Bardash. That is one of the shows that is going to push. And also we did a long conversation about the, the Muxhe- Muxe, Muxerism as a third gender in indigenous cultures of, of south Mexico and was very important to understand his whole career as a creator.

Like how one thing is inside the other and the other and the other, and how the audience, as I said before, can connect in different ways with, with its work. 

Gabrielle Martin: From your perspective, like as we, you know, we could talk for a long time, but as we kind of wrap up this conversation, um, what kinds of artistic futures are Latin American makers carving out for themselves, um, you know, despite the neocolonialism, despite economic and political challenges?

What’s your perspective on that? 

Cecilia Kuska: Um, first say there is something that I always say that mention in many international meetings that is that I come from the future. 

Gabrielle Martin: Mm-hmm. 

Cecilia Kuska: And this means that the economic and social crisis that we have lived through Latin America, uh, eventually reach other regions as well.

And growing up in Argentina, born in the ’80s, like taught me to live e- with a lot of uncertainty, uh, like with not certain basis economically, institutionally, and in a conta- in a very constant economic crisis. So I feel this is something that is very pregnant in what we call Latin America or Latin American, uh, creative community.

How we really know or how we born with this idea of rebuild ourself from a scratch and rebuild ourself when we have low resources. And, and there is something that we, we say a lot in Argentina that is we fix or tie things with wire. Lo arreglamos con alambre. Which, uh, which means that even no having like a lot of resources or institutional support, we find a way And but I feel like something that is happening nowadays in a more strong, a stronger way than maybe that also happens in other moments, but now it’s back, is this new version of censorship, uh, of budget cuts.

Like I know that’s everywhere, but imagine if, if it’s in a place where it was already, you know, really a strong budgets for culture, and there is a lot of political pressure trying to instrumentalize the art or the art scene. So we are facing this global issue, this, uh, extractive violence like in many places of the world and, and we are starting also to face like, like the struggles over basic resources like access to water.

But, uh, and, and I’m saying all this because I feel the Latin American performing arts scene have always re-mentaled itself under pressure, which I don’t… Uh, saying this, it doesn’t mean that that’s okay and that’s how we should be. I disagree with that. But now, and I feel more than ever, we need more cross-border collaborations and a deep listening, a more collective like understanding and, and empathy.

And so I feel the scene will continue growing And will continue being a activist. ‘Cause there is something that always has been, like, very, very strong in what we call Latin America, there is this activism, artivism through art. I recently, uh, heard from a colleague that went to, like, encounter about artivists where they were saying that there is less and less in the world, and I feel that’s really not what I see in Latin America.

I f- I, I see that there is, uh, there is a soul of community, of community building the projects because we, as, as we usually approach friends to collaborate and create a new work, is you have to, you know, make friendships or new friendships for, for, for a start a project because your lack of fundings. And so I feel, uh, the scene will try to find a way of, of face the challenges together.

This is how we always have been doing, you know? And so I feel each artist will continue creating for their own experiences with or without privilege. That I don’t feel they will … that the political forces, sociopolitical forces will be able to kill, uh, the, the strength and the f- the, the, you know, the energy that the Latin American creators can have and can develop over years.

So, so it’s difficult to know. I mean, the world is changing so fast. The global political, the politic context is very scary. Uh, but I feel like art more than ever is the place where we will be able to meet after the silence. 

Gabrielle Martin: I think that wraps up our conversation. Beautiful. Thank you. Thank you so much, Cecilia